The fact that it is 2011 and we still have these old antiquated laws is asinine to me – especially when you consider the majority of our bordering neighbors have liquor laws that are “up to date” with the majority of the country. Is our state government trying to protect us from something? If that is the case, please don’t do me any favors. My point of view comes from that of a craft beer connoisseur unable to find the array of great breweries this country has to offer in our state, much less a grocery store.

As most of us know, OKC is getting a Whole Foods in a few months and my question is what is Whole Foods without wine tastings and an enormous beer selection? What is the harm in going to the grocery store to pick up the ingredients for an Italian style dinner and having the ability to pick up a bottle of wine 3 isles over?

I am glad to see that progress is being made but I am not surprised that it is being delayed another year. That is very Oklahoman of them. We are already years, if not decades behind the majority of other states when it comes to alcohol laws, what’s ANOTHER year? It is crazy to me that a handful of states have legalized the use of medicinal marijuana and we can’t get a decent selection of craft beer, cold, in the grocery store. I don’t feel like it is too much to ask. Honestly.

So the gist of the “complexity of changing Oklahoma’s alcohol laws” really boils down to backlash from the liquor stores and distributors who want to protect their little oligopoly, consumers be damned. They basically don’t want to invest the capital to upgrade their stores for refrigeration and they don’t want to actually have competitors in the market place.

I’ve looked at the Oklahoma alcohol laws. Allowing cold beer and wine to be sold in liquor stores and “strong beer” and wine to be sold in grocery stores is most certainly NOT complex. From what I can tell, if all you wanted to do was allow cold beer to be sold in liquor stores you need to remove one sentence from two statutes. If you wanted to allow strong beer and wine to be sold in grocery stores I believe there is an additional one statute that needs to be changed.

It’s time we stop pandering to the entrenched interests and start thinking about what’s best for the consumer and the economy. It’s time to get modern with our alcohol laws.

Hey Oklahoma, 1982 called, they want their alcohol laws back.

All of this just to get out of state businesses to come to Oklahoma, or at least to allow them to sell wine and beer in their stores. Putting Oklahoma small businesses out of business doesn’t seem like a very viable plan. There is a lot more that goes into this than people think, its not something to be taken lightly.

BierGartenOK: I’m not buying it. I want proof that it will kill small businesses in Oklahoma. Have you been to Texas recently? Oddly enough they seem to have liquor stores and grocery stores coexisting in relative harmony. What makes Oklahoma different?

If you are telling me that some businesses won’t be able to survive with more competition then I say welcome to capitalism. Welcome to the free market. Adapt and grow or die because your product is inferior.

The only arguments I’ve seen against reforming Oklahoma alcohol laws are as follows: 1) Small liquor stores that can’t figure out how to work in a competitive environment will close, and 2) Liquor stores will have a large capital expense to install refrigeration. Weak.

Instead, we should embrace competition, capitalism, and the free-market. We should join the rest of the progressive states and allow wine and beer to be sold cold and in grocery stores. Bring NEW businesses to Oklahoma that actually know how to thrive in a competitive environment. This creates jobs, this creates tax revenue, this increases the quality of the product.

Your argument is that we shouldn’t change our alcohol laws because some businesses can’t handle competition. I say again, tear down the oligopoly and let the people decide where they want to shop.

Im not going to argue with you brotha! Its the internet. All I am saying is that this state is based on these laws. I am a liquor store owner, I have based my store around these laws. Its my lively hood. I am a smaller sized store but carry an awesome selection especially in craft beers. I work my store myself from Open to close (9:30-9:30) 6 days a week. with help from my business partner and girlfriend only on the weekends. I do this because I actually care about my business and my customers. My level of customer service is far beyond many stores in the area for that reason. I understand you feel inconvenienced because of our laws, but is inconvenience a big enough reason to change the laws entirely? I think not. Most of the stores wanting to come into Oklahoma and sell wine and beer are from out of state. This means that the money leaves OK instead of staying in the state. You do this and its even going to hurt the local grocery stores. Wal-Mart is going to come in and take over. Trust me I have friends that are in the wine industry for Wal-Mart. They have their own trucks, their own warehouses and there own people. Cutting Oklahoma out entirely. The only people that Oklahoma laws bother are people from other states. Im imagining that you are not from OK. I grew up here and it never really seemed like a big deal to me. There are 2 laws that I would LOVE to see changed though. Allowing children inside the store and allowing breweries to have real brew pubs where beer can be sold and consumed right there! It has nothing to do with competition, it just has to do with people like me being able to make a living. It would be extremely hard for any liquor store to pay for refrigeration and get the space for it. Just for some people to have the convenience. Its not enough, its not worth it.

1 more thing, your argument is very one sided. Imagine what ever business you do. What if someone came in an bought you out or drove you out of business. Im just saying, would this be something you supported? Probably not. We all have to survive, but you cannot just rip peoples lively hoods out from under them because of 1 store wanting to come into a state. Its selfish and not right. Look, If the law would have already been that way when I opened, no big deal! But to change it mid stream, man that is insane.

BierGartenOK, I hope you are saving money for refrigeration if you plan on being in business in 5 years. The laws will change, and you will be left in the dust. I am tempted to start a liquor store myself once the laws change, just to be the one that puts you out of business and proves to you that you have to change with the times. This is not intended to put Oklahomans out of business. Here’s a tip: build a business that gives people what they want. We want good, cold beer and we want to buy it in grocery and liquor stores. You can either take advantage of that demand when the time comes or can whine about how poor little you cant keep up and you can cash it in. good luck.

Ya Russ pretty tough behind a computer. If your so awesome why haven’t you opened a store yet? Its easy to talk about these things when you are not involved at all in the business. At least I have the confidence to start my business, and work it every day of the week, I seriously doubt you understand what it takes to do what I do. Its easy to talk about something you know nothing about it. But, this is pointless to argue, especially on the internet. You guys see it one way I see it another. If you did not let your ignorance stand in the way, maybe these laws would have already been passed. But its people like you that stand in the way of change, because your so extremely one-sided. It has to work for all involved or it simply cannot work. You ever feel the need to come talk about this in person my address is 807 E A st suite 107 in Jenks Oklahoma. My door is always open.

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I’m very involved in the industry, but let’s not get in a blow-off tube measuring contest here. It’s not about me being tough or smart enough to open my own store. I commend you for that. Being a small business owner takes guts. But on that same note, you have to be able to adapt to change, not lobby against it out of fear. You are scared that if the laws change, someone else will put in refrigeration first and you will fall behind. That’s pretty rational. But, why not be that guy who does it first, be a trailblazer in your industry, and win the hearts of the masses? By lobbying against Oklahoma alcohol law reform, you are denying the people something they clearly want, all for your own pocket book.

“If you did not let your ignorance stand in the way, maybe these laws would have already been passed.” – Did you look at the mirror and say this to yourself? I’m confused…

Russ, all I am saying is that if the laws would have been changed before I opened my doors then I would have made room for expansion. We have built our store completely out of wood and we did all the work ourselves. Yes if we had to we would change to accommodate the times. We would make room for refrigeration because we would HAVE to to compete and give our customers what they desire. All I am saying, is that it would be a tremendous undertaking and yet another expenditure that we would have to pay for in a business that is mildly profitable. If you are in the industry as you say then you know this. Its very HARD to make a profit in this business. You have to know all the in’s and outs. I have to stay on top of my wholesalers, brokers and reps just to get the product I want in my store. Having to compete with more stores…well that’s another story. I do not have the luxury of asking family or friends for loans or things like this. This is a personal business, when I buy product its MY money I’m using not someone else’s. I was not aware how hard this industry is to be in and be competitive in. Now I know. You say you want to open a store, I say Don’t, its not worth it. Do something else. I love my store, its EVERYTHING to me. But I HATE the business. Its tough to fight for everything and then have to worry about this. I cannot speak for everyone, but this is all I have, its how I support my family. Its a stepping stone for me, because sure I wont be doing this forever, but I just hope and prey I dont have to worry about these laws. Its already hard enough and I am already working 80+ hours a week, what more can I do? Its very scary. I have everything I own in this business, I put my BALL$ on the table to follow my dream, and it could change just because of some grocery store? I mean really? Is it that important to get wine and beer in a grocery store? Would you not rather come get beer from me? From your friend that you see every time you come in and we talk about beers and talk about life in general? You would lose this personal touch if stores like mine went away. Its not MY fault that the laws are the way they are…I just had to abide by them. My the ignorance statement, I meant that if you saw things from my perspective, maybe you wouldn’t say such hurtful things as “I am tempted to start a liquor store myself once the laws change, just to be the one that puts you out of business and proves to you that you have to change with the times.” That is wrong and you have no idea what you are saying. This store is my life and NOTHING is going to get in the way of that. I’m sorry Russ, but maybe you should think about your words before you just say them, these issues involve people’s livelihoods.

“It has to work for all involved or it simply cannot work.”

Wrong. This isn’t socialism. It doesn’t have to work for all. It only has to work for the best. When you buy groceries, do you go to every grocery store in town so it works for everyone? My guess is probably not. This is why businesses fail. Reluctance to change is a small business death wish.

You’re right, saying I wanted to start a store just to put you out was mean spirited, and I didn’t mean that. I 100% support local business over big box when it makes sense. I apologize.

Still, change with the times or get pushed aside. It’s a harsh reality.

No doubt Russ, just a little easier for you to say…..

I absolutely love reading the open discussion. Thank you for providing the platform.

I understand both of the arguments made here. My main complaint is this:

I go to California every other month at which time I frequent my favorite wineries. I’ve fallen in love with quite a few that I can’t find a suitable replacement for here in OK. I would LOVE to be able to have a case of it shipped to me or even join a “wine of the month” club. Unfortunately I’m unable to do so because of Oklahoma law.

I’ve tried to order through my local liquor store but the small wineries aren’t on an “approved list” so they can’t even order it. What about my desire to have a glass of my favorite wine with dinner? Should I just “settle” for something that just doesn’t satisfy my pallet or fight for my ability to choose which wine I am able to purchase? To me, it’s not about running small business put of town; hell, if a liquor store could order my favorite wine I’d gladly order from them even if it’s a few dollars more than direct shipping. I just want my wine!!!