Where OSU football is better than OU
The Bedlam battle for football bragging rights could come down to how you answer this question:
What’s more important to you, winning and making your name on Saturdays or playing and starring on Sundays?
University of Oklahoma football fans may point to last month’s NFL Draft, say “both” and claim superiority. In Sam Bradford, Gerald McCoy and Trent Williams, the Sooners had three of the top five overall picks. Add Jermaine Greshman, picked 21st by Cincinnati, and you’ve got one of the best draft classes in the last decade.
And the Sooners are going to need that quartet to play that way on Sundays if they’re going to catch their Bedlam rivals when it comes to producing elite NFL talent, at least according to a recent ESPN survey.
Barry Sanders waves to the crowd during the college football game between Oklahoma State University and the University of Missouri at Boone Pickens Stadium in Stillwater, Okla. Saturday, Oct. 17, 2009. Photo by Sarah Phipps, The Oklahoman.
OU’s dominance in its Bedlam series with Oklahoma State is built by winning on Saturdays, but according to ESPN’s survey, OSU has the advantage when it comes to developing NFL elite players.
ESPN accessed NFL drafts from 1979 to 2009, awarding one point for each player who was named NFL MVP, defensive player of the year, offensive player of the year or All-Pro (first- or second-team). It also awarded one point for each Pro Bowl appearance.
Oklahoma State’s production was enough to land the Cowboys on ESPN’s 16-program bracket. (An aside: As goofy as this may sound, I love brackets and this is what sports departments do to keep college football readers interested when spring football is over and you’re months away from starting to crank out preview stories).
The Cowboys lost to top-seed Miami in the first round (top 5 Cowboys: Barry Sanders, Thurman Thomas, Kevin Williams, Leslie O’Neal, Jason Gildon; top 5 Hurricanes: Ray Lewis, Warren Sapp, Cortez Kennedy, Ed Reed, Michael Irvin). But still.
And as for Bedlam, the Cowboys hold a 34-25 advance in Pro Bowl appearances for players drafted from 1979-2009, according to pro-football-reference.com. It would a near dead heat if you added Troy Aikman’s six Pro Bowls and Glyn Milburn’s two to the Sooner total, but that’s bogus. Aikman transferred to UCLA, Milburn to Stanford.
By the way, here’s the tally of Pro Bowl appearances for Cowboys and Sooners drafted from 1979-2009, according to pro-football-reference.com:
Cowboys (34)
– Barry Sanders 10
– Leslie O’Neal 6
– Thurman Thomas 5
– Kevin Williams 5
– Jason Gildon 3
– Jammal Williams 3
– Cary Blanchard 1
– Dexter Manley 1
Sooners (25):
– Keith Jackson 5
– Roy Williams 5
– Billy Sims 3
– Tommie Harris 3
– Adrian Peterson 3
– Jammal Brown 2
– Kenny King 1
– Stephen Alexander 1
– Scott Case 1
– Davin Joseph 1
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Comments
That had to have been written by a big Poke fan. They had to search long and hard to figure out a way that OSU had an edge over OU. I wouldn’t give it much credit though, OU still leads in every other aspect of the series.
Well, we all know the NFL Pro Bowl is soooooo important since many of those voted to play in it skip it and even some die hard football fans don’t even watch it. This list also doesn’t account for injuries and transferrs. Aikman was a Sooner and he is not listed. Should he be thrown out just because he transferred?
You can have your moral victory of players in the Pro Bowl. I like all the titles OU has.
It must feel nice for OSU to have something over OU, even if it requires cherry picking stats and accomplishments that have nothing to do with college football.
Not to make excuses but, some of OU’s highly rated draftees couldn’t stay healthy. No guarantee they would have made the Pro Bowl though. Looking at Barry Sanders 10 appearances it looks like one solid guy who avoids injury and has a long career can move the numbers. Give OSU credit. Facts are facts.
Why only take from 1979 to 2009? I’d like to see the numbers since 1950. Always have to distort the numbers to give them pokes a chance.
Brian:
I’m not sure why ESPN picked that time frame? Thirty years is a nice round number. I’m not sure there’s a rationale argument for saying Oklahoma State has a better football program. But as this survey points out, you can make an argument that the Cowboys have produced better NFL players the last three decades. I’ve heard several people say that OSU’s Pro Bowl numbers are padded by Barry Sanders, but consider this: Sanders walked away at age 31. Probably could have made a couple more Pro Bowls, although nothing’s guaranteed for over-30 running backs. I just thought the survey was an interesting way of looking at things.
By taking a certain time frame one can make an arguement out
of anything. Take the past decade for instance. Im sure
Oklahoma has more pro bowls by far than OSU. Its just how you want to look at it. Just seems to me that poke fans are always trying to get an angle.
Why would anyone even think of checking such crap? Means absolutely nothing and makes no difference whatever. ESPN has never done anything that convinces me they have a reason for existance, other than show me college football, basketball and baseball. Their announcers are jokes. I hate it when they do St. Louis Cardinals baseball because of the lack of announcers. Orel Hershiser is the best of the three and he isn’t good. I’m sure my ‘Pokes fan cousin will be trying to throw this in my face but I won’t let it bother me. The sport is played on the field and the stats speak for themselves.
Look at the list of schools in the Top 16. Florida, Ohio State, Florida State, USC, Michigan, Georgia, Miami…
The list is what it is “cherry picking” nothing.
Elite NFL “Pipeline” Schools. OU didn’t even make the Top 25.
ESPN did the study, not OSU.
The wishbone certainly helped OU athletes be successful collegiately but did very little for their NFL careers. OSU has had some really great NFL players also. Why is there always a few OU fans who must look like complete babies? Is it plausible that other schools are better in certain areas? Believe it or not, Texas was behind OSU as well. Complaining about the time frame of the stats, Troy Aikman, etc. is just very childish and makes you look like a whiner. Get a life…
I thought this was interesting to read, but to me the angle it accenuates is that even with tremendous pro players like Barry Sanders, Thurman Thomas and Leslie O’Neil who accounted for 21 of the 34 Pro Bowl appearances–those three players never beat OU or won a conference title while in college. Correct me if I’m wrong, but unlike Bob Simmons and Les Miles who both had some success against OU—the Pat Jones players never once beat OU during Pat’s tenure. I’m not dissing Pat because I love him on the radio, but that is a fact.
To me– what is staggering in reading this list is that Barry Sanders is the best back I’ve ever seen in my life and Thurman Thomas played in multiple Super Bowls for the Bills–and yet they couldn’t get it done against OU.
Conversely–if you look at this list how many pro bowl appearances are represented by the Les Miles era when O State beat OU twice when OU was good?
I think there are multiple ways you can interpret this list, but it was interesting to read.
If he stays healthy at least 5 more Pro bowl appearances will be added by Dez Bryant and a few more by Russell Okung. And if Troy Aikman stayed at OU no way he is as successful in the pros.
Mike Sherman–if you have time–what would be interesting to me would be to read the O State first team all-star team during the Pat Jones era. Twenty two plus the place kicker and the punter…and then maybe do the same for Switzer during the years only in which Switzer and Jones coached against each other. That might be fun.
Wow Darryl is bringing the big guns out. The police blotter comment is a classic example of the crap that comes out of an OSU fans mouths for the continous beatdowns in bedlam football. Is the police blotter comment a moral victory for you? How do you know Troy would have been a bust at OU? OU wasn’t running the wishbone with Aikman. Good luck trying to find a conference.
OSU fan would you rather play in four national title games since 2000 and lose three of them … or have more Pro Bowlers in the NFL?
I’m an OSU fan but I have to give respect to OU. They will always more tradition in football due to their success. I’m not really interested in the past though. I’m more interested in the future. I hope both schools have as much success as is possible. I’m a firm believer that OSU will continue to get better while OU will have to struggle in the near future to sustain their past success. They have raised and kept the bar very high for a long time and have given OSU a high level to shoot for. This article misses the mark for me. Maybe the paper should give us more in-depth coverage of the players that will be playing this year ie, some of their best football moments, areas where they can improve, etc. Now that would be news and help the fans be more knowledgeable about their teams.
Within the next 10 years OU will more than blow by OSU on this list. OSU can thank Barry Sanders for this. Not OU fault Injuries have killed may former Sooners careers in the pros. Billy Simms would of been one of the greatest if not for injury.
OSU fans you are more than welcome to take this trophy home if you want it. In fact Matt and Bob, I’ll even have one made for you. I’ll take 24-5-1 in the last 30 years which included OU’s worst decade of football any day. So pokes who is to blame for your futility? Is it coaches, lack of facilities, inferior public support?
So . . . that only proves OSU coaches don’t do as well as they should with the talent that have. We’ve always know that.
“(An aside: As goofy as this may sound, I love brackets and this is what sports departments do to keep college football readers interested when spring football is over and you’re months away from starting to crank out preview stories).” LMAO! It worked Mr. Sherman. That statement made me laugh, but reading the comments from the other readers was almost as funny.
Good job by OSU from a Sooner fan. OSU has had some very great players in their history of playing football. They have had some great players but not enough very good ones to substain success year in and year out.
Haha, what is up with the OU fans getting their panties in a wad? OSU didn’t create this bracket. ESPN did. OU has had better teams over the last 30 years and OSU has had better NFL players. What’s the big deal? Let it go.
Apparentley winning on Saturday’s puts twice as many butts in the seats and you get to see great football in person.
Winning on Sunday means you get individual locally produced players from the comfort of your living room.
OU fans can do both.
Aside from Barry Sanders, the stats are even for this timeframe. The comment about going back to 1950 or to include the modern era would give this article additional insight. An OSU friend of mine liked to point out a few years ago that OSU owned the series for the last five years (which was true – Simmons and Miles), but got quiet when I’d ask him about all the years before that. This article is great Bedlam Bait, with interesting stats, and designed to get us fired up on each other. The only thing it shows me is how dominating Sanders was. Barry Sanders was one of the greatest players of all time in football, period. He put up huge stats for one of the worst teams in the NFL, and the classy way he would hand the football to the official after scoring ANOTHER touchdown showed his greatness.
Last decade score: Sooners 14 to Cowboys 9 (and it is hard to believe Dexter Manley should be wanted on anyone’s list relating to a school of higher education!!)
The 70s were pretty good to OU players in the NFL. Greg Pruitt went to 5 Pro Bowls & Lee Roy Selman went to 4 or five. I think Joe Washington went to 1. Tommy McDonald, the Hall-of-Fame WR from OU made a few pro bowls too in the 50s & 60s… Add one more decade & OU catches up would be my guess. Add two more & OU would have a big lead.
John Kolb played in the 70′s and went to 5 pro bowls. So I don’t know if OU catches OSU if the decade of the 70′s is included.
Bob Stoop’s will rectify that comparison chart. The last 5 season’s he’s turned
the Sooner program into a player mill for the pro’s. It’s all about Individual
Awards and draft position at Norman. He thinks thats what he was hired for.
Do most of you idiots realize that this whole thing was not put together by anyone at OSU or anyone affiliated with OSU. It was done by ESPN and was done for all teams equally so claiming that OSU made this to look better just shows how stupid most of you are…
Don’t forget Hart Lee Dykes got hurt and probably would have had a handful of probowls. And Walt Garrison is the best cowboy ever!
Wow, look at how this article has kicked the gooner ant hill and all the little insecure gooners are boiling out. You people must be real pieces of work in real life. What is it about being a gooner that attacts so many pitifully insecure people? It’s just a story. Have you nothing else in life to hold on to?
WOW good job Osu all that talent and you mustered what a whopping one co big 8 championship, and in the Big 12 well you guys dont bring much to the table, hell you guys will be riding our coat tails to wherever we go or do not go conference wise. But take your moral victories although I would not be so proud considering what you did(or did not do) with all those All-pros you churn out.
I love how osu fans call us Sooners, “gooners”, like it’s suppose to insult us… Every time I see it I chuckle a little bit. I guess what I’m saying is, thanks for the laugh!
There may be no dispute that Cowboys have done well in the NFL as opposed to OU. Logic then would dictate that their coaches didn’t get them to perform at a level they should have. Otherwise, they would be showing off all of those Big 8/Big 12 tiles that they don’t have now!
I love Barry Sanders, best running back ever, college or pro. First thing he die was honor his mother and father, like AD and others. He always gave credit to his line. He could have set incredible stats, but if the game was won, he said, let it go. He was incredibly humble and I have to respect that. However, OU is the best college football team, collectively speaking, in the nation ever IMHO.
OU fans, let OSU have this one, I have no problem with this statistic. Check back in a couple of years and lets see who is winning the championships, hope for my Sooners. Boomer!
Way more important to in Big 12 and national titles; not even a valid argument. You can find other loser programs that have produced a good number of pro bowl appearances.