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As called for in plans drawn up by architect Rand Elliott.
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Thats what some people think all of Oklahoma looks like….nothing but flat land, red dirt and few to no trees
If memory serves, trees are being replanted as part of the design. So…trees grow, it isn’t the end of the world. Bigger things to worry about.
Yes, but some of the trees that got uprooted were several decades old contrary to what was reported to the design committee. I guess one’s view depends on how one views the importance of old growth trees in the urban landscape.
The end result will obviously be more appealing, but in the meantime the City Council has to look at this wasteland every day. I hope they do not regret their decision.
While I share the opinion that the tree removal was unnecessary, I think it is not fair to pass judgement on this redesign until the project is finished. This picture does nothing but try to put the worst possible face on the project and incite public opinion to be negative. Steve, you are better than this as a journalist. I have great respect for you, but not when you resort to something like this. “As called for in plans drawn up by architect Rand Elliott.” Surely you don’t mean to imply that this ugly stage is part of the Rand Elliot design. This is just a particular stage of the project, and not the design of the project.
Once complete and the new plantings start to mature, THEN is the appropriate time to ask if it was a good or bad idea. If it is ultimately bad then everyone should critique away. But if it winds up being good, everyone should be honest and mature enough to give it credit, too. Fair is fair.
Willy, it was scraped clean of all the old growth trees and monuments as called for in plans drawn up by Rand Elliott. That is not an editorial comment – it is simply a fact. If it’s a good thing or a bad thing, it is what it is.
[...] trees at the Oklahoma City Civic Center. They are all gone. Steve Lackmeyer has a photo up at his OKC Central blog documenting the [...]
I think it was Sam Noble who wrote –
Who you are is what you do
and nothing more.
“I am” is the name of God.
Your name, sir, is “I do –
by the grace of God.”
Failing this, you have no name
at all.
This will be a generation of big shot Oklahomans known much more for what they destroyed than for what they built.
As with the needless destruction of irreplaceable OKC Union Station yard and the S. Robinson and S. Walker underpasses at the hands of the same bunch of thugs and their ever-compliant, anything-for-a-buck “professional” toadies, this vile desecration of another historic place made beloved of many individual citizens over decades of time has been swept away for no other reason than to prove “we is duh boss.”
Their grandfathers, either by blood or by corrupt spirit, destroyed most of the architectural treasures of downtown.
Their great grandfathers yanked out central Oklahoma’s electric trolley and interurban system — on the heels of its heroic support of the homefront effort and domestic economy through the Great Depression and World War II, apparently to make dead certain nobody moved in Oklahoma City without crawling to them and their “associates” for automobiles and all the perpetual expense and trouble that they require from each individual and family.
These are bad people doing bad things for bad reasons — chief of which, apparently, is to constantly reinforce the notion that there really is no “public commons” in Oklahoma. It all belongs to them to do with as they please on whatever shallow whim blows through their minds.
Our “State Historic Preservation Office” belongs to them — not to us, so no help there, although we have to wonder what we pay “public servants” like Bob Blackburn for.
Justice Robert H. Jackson wrote, “It is not the function of our government to keep the citizen from falling into error; it is the function of the citizen to keep the government from falling into error.” The Oklahoma public needs to finally wake up, grow up, stand up — and stop such nonsense.
By the way, I linked to this discussion today.
My readers are pretty upset about the trees.
You don’t have to thank me. I was happy to do it.
Umm, they’re just trees, not the end of the world. They will grow again. I know we just measure things by our lifetimes, but my kids will show their kids the new trees and think: “What’s the big deal, trees grow.” And then it will start all over again. Trees don’t live forever.
What was the species of tree(s) cut down and what is the typical lifespan of those trees? I would imagine those trees were getting to old age anyway. Perhaps I just have a different thought on trees since I lived in a lumbering area for a while…you cut them, replant and in 30-40 years do it all over again. Now the monuments being permanently removed, that may be another story.
Well I thought that was beautiful, Brent.
I wish I could find someone that writes like you do
to do my Tweets for me. I would pay 50 cents a tweet.
What lumbering area was that?
Trees are a renewable resource. It looks ugly now but it will look nice when finished. The interim pictures show nothing of any intelligence though other than it is a construction site. Nothing more nothing less.
I get a chuckle at all the “urban designers” that pontificate here and elsehwere who have little to no clue about the subject they are speaking about. Kinda like all there taste in in their mouths huh??? Wake up and smell the coffee.
“They’re just trees” and “Don’t judge it until the project is finished” make me sick.
So we’re not supposed to evaluate a single proposal until projects are finished? Hey, here’s an idea: lets just wait until AFTER project completion to issue building permits. We already do this for some, and the permitting process is a joke for the rest.
I’m sorry, but to recklessly disregard what little canopy we have is why we never get ahead on that. And someone remind me what urban planning background the chk architect has anyway? The designs were awful. Honestly, I was one of the few who liked the spinner towers but that one defining feature was hastily.scrapped last minute to get the permit.
We are going to regret this. Watch, in 10 years we’ll spend millions re doing it all again. The one positive is city hall is forced to look at this debacle every day.
This makes me sick! Another Sandridge! Shows who is important in OKC. Those with the money not those who understand urban design or building communities.
I hope it is not as ugly as what Sandridge has done with their cedar forest.
I would say that the time to ask “is this a good idea” is BEFORE something is destroyed. Be it a building or trees.
while i’m not endorsing every viewpoint that has been expressed condemning the removal of the trees, there is one thing i’ll say. you would NEVER see somebody get away with this in the old part of norman.
You would NEVER see someone get away with any of this in other cities. It’s insane. The oiligarchy couldn’t build a city even if they xeroxed Dubai.
How about the elms and oaks they’ve cut down because
of the construction on Lindsey/Lindsay in Norman?
you mean where it’s been flooding and they’re trying to stop the flooding? that’s not the same thing at all. furthermore, they’re not removing ALL the trees to give norman a “new look”. they also aren’t going outside of what is absolutely necessary, like mowing down the side streets. this project is about aesthetics, not some type of infrastructure failure.
1. Do you mean the flooding on Flood or on Lindsey/Lindsay?
2. What old part of Norman?
3. A little worried about the xeroxing Dubai thing.
Is that really possible?
4. Are any of these questions going to be answered?
Now it looks ugly. It is called CONSTRUCTION!!! david have you ever seen a construction location that looked nice in the construction phase…NOPE.
It is hypocryisy/illogical to say tree removel for aesthetis is wrong but to do it for infrastructure failure is okay. Consistency in thought david.
Tbh, I really think Norman is a very poorly ran city as well. Norman isnt even attempting the magnitude we are, or even anything audacious for their city size, and the demands of sprawl won out in the end there. And the unp fiasco still has me angry and unhappy about anything Norman does.
But I stand by everyone’s criticism of this park redesign however. Yeah, it’s the construction phase, very keen observation. However the point is everybody thought at least SOME mature trees should be incorporated. Then the unthinkable happened and they were all turn down and no plan for reusing the monuments elsewhere. And as a last and most vital point to morons who think its too soon to judge: actually, it’s too late. We all saw the renders, that was the time. City Council tried stopping this bad idea, but somebody got to them the next week. This was FORCED through. So what are we doing now? All we can, bitching as loud as possible. This is sad that civic engagement has been diminished to this.
Oh and fire Couch (yeah right) if you ever want this to change. This guy has either lost his edge or never had it to begin. The incompetence and poor execution in last 4 years, MAPS mishandling, now this among countless other horrible projects. He needs to leave. I just don’t see how he masterfully escapes all of the blame for all of this. You’ve got to start looking at the top. Stop attacking mid level folks just working for a living. Attack the dude making more than anyone, ruining and corrupting our city, and taking all the credit and none of the blame.
my comments are directed at the clearcutting in putting up the new park, and always consistently have been. the park was not a flooding, failed piece of infrastructure. rather, it had come to be considered unfashionable and i felt that utilizing mature trees in the new design was both possible and desirable. norman has old neighborhoods lined with mature trees, both on lindsay and intersecting with it. old photos of norman reveal it to have been a treeless grassland. i believe that if the city fathers of norman were to suggest clearcutting those neighborhoods to install, say, new sidewalks and curbs, there would be an outcry against it. perhaps i’m wrong. maybe nichols hills will also get on the modern bandwagon and eliminate its tree-lined streets, as well. to characterize my statements as being a complaint about the appearance of a construction area either shows a lack of comprehension about what i DID say, or a deliberate lack of candor. i will assume that i failed to state my position clearly.
David you did. Apology tentatively accepted. I would in the future be very careful of using anything in Norman as a benchmark for good. Those with living brain cells know all about Normans lousy planning.
I am curious if you are an educated urban planner or just another opinion?
You can’t get there from here.