Comments on: The Fall of the Rise of the Creative Class Theory

By: Colin

Colin — Sat, 02 Oct 2010 09:13:17 +0000

I’m not an economist, nor do I have any desire to be one, but here’s my take. Richard Florida was right…in 1998. Did creative industry add to the explosion of the hot spot cities he mentions at the expense of cities reliant on heavy industry? Yes, to some extent, they did. Product design and marketing are two things that Americans do really well, so they didn’t get outsourced as much in the 90s. What I think he failed to notice was that the success of his creative class (which is a misnomer anyway) was dependent on three other sectors booming in these cities: banking, higher ed, and real estate. Banking and real estate take a beating, and you’ve got yourself a one legged stool. Higher Ed isn’t looking much better with the decreasing availability of student loans and cutbacks in state budgets…Looking at his list again all these years later, it seems even sillier to me. I doubt that anyone would seriously argue that Houston is rich because artists want to live there, and Providence down at the bottom is home to one of the best design schools in the world, Rhode Island School of Design. “Does not stand up to critical scrutiny. B-” is what I would write on his essay.

By: Lee

Lee — Tue, 28 Sep 2010 21:24:44 +0000

In truth, we’re all minorities in the 21st century – everything is a lifestyle choice: from having kids, living in the burbs, and attending Church on a regular basis; to being a childless gay/straight, bohemian urban-dweller. The cities that pitch the biggest tent and make everyone feel comfortable are likely to “win” – however we choose to define it. — Michael Heaton

This statement is brilliant and is perfect for our city.

By: Jeffrey

Jeffrey — Tue, 28 Sep 2010 16:37:36 +0000

Matt, I had a friend that moved here from Dallas, graduated H.S. and took off to Austin to play in his band because “that’s where things were happening.” Guess what, it’s a year later, he and his entire band have left Austin and now reside . . . in OKC where all are attending the ACM.

The drain may not be flowing as fast as you think.

By: slackmeyer

slackmeyer — Tue, 28 Sep 2010 03:10:55 +0000

Matt, all is good with us, we’re having a good discussion here. I was recently in Colorado Springs. It was beautiful there – and a superficial survey would indicate all is well. But I did research before going there, and with a more critical eye, I saw the signs of a city in distress – dark street lights at night, unmowed medians, etc. I’m sure that at first glance all appears well in San Francisco – but the numbers paint a different picture. And it was those numbers that Florida relied on so heavily to make his case.
Maybe he should have simply stuck to a much simpler message – that having a vibrant creative class adds to a community’s well being. That’s a message that was being pushed in OKC a half century ago by Nan Sheets. I suspect Florida felt he had to churn some numbers to sell books and charge big fees for his speaking tours.

By: jen

jen — Tue, 28 Sep 2010 01:21:06 +0000

So interesting that you’d write about Florida because I was just reflecting on his work the other day and thinking about the Creative Class. You’ve asked some great questions. I enjoyed most of the comments.

What I remember about that time when Florida’s work was being hyped was that OCU conducted a study on public funding for the arts. Many Oklahomans began to see public funding for the arts as not some fringe off shoot of the NEA, but as something that drove local economic development and invited private investment. For every $1 invested, OCU Business school determined a $3 or $4 return in private dollars. Florida’s study was instrumental in helping shape arguments to support continued public funding for the arts.

Since those early days when Oklahomans dared discuss the arts as components of economic development, private investment in the arts in Oklahoma has increased significantly. So, while Florida’s premise seems to have utterly failed, Oklahoma used the information he provided to fortify existing arts organizations and make way for new creative ideas.

Public funding for the arts has paved many initial bricks in this town. It has done so for – what – 40 years now? Never in the history of Oklahoma has so little gone so far and done so much.

By: Kris Bryant

Kris Bryant — Tue, 28 Sep 2010 00:12:46 +0000

Initially, Florida would have defined creative class by nose rings and tattoos. He has been forced to broaden the definition to include nearly every professional who uses their brain to work…which in turn, makes his ideas less meaningful.

By: Matt

Matt — Tue, 28 Sep 2010 00:10:39 +0000

I wasn’t coming after you, Steve. Sorry you took it that way. I really totally agree with your post, and Michael’s comment for that matter. It is pretty obvious that Florida had a concept that helped him write some books and make him some money. Wish I had an idea like that.

I just had a different take than what you said about SF. I didn’t see a lot of homes or townhomes up for sale. I didn’t see closed up shops. I stayed in Cole Valley in the heart of SF. Maybe it is in bad shape but it sure didn’t look like it.

Another point: Why, you ask, was I in SF? My buddy got married out there and I was in the wedding. I was the only person in the wedding that doesn’t live in SF, but I went to school with all of those guys at OU. The talent drain is still flowing.

By: slackmeyer

slackmeyer — Mon, 27 Sep 2010 23:31:50 +0000

Matt, I didn’t say San Francisco is “in ruins.” What I am saying is housing defaults are high, unemployment high, mortgages are under water. The figures don’t lie – San Francisco and the State of California are in bad shape.
I find it interesting this post is taken as an attack on the creative class – being an author, wouldn’t I be a part of that creative class? Or do I need to wear a nose ring to qualify?
What I am doing is questioning the cult of Richard Florida and suggesting that it’s not a clear cut issue here. Go read Michael’s comment – it’s the most interesting take on this I’ve seen in this thread.

By: Matt

Matt — Mon, 27 Sep 2010 23:20:39 +0000

Correction for you, Steve. Just got back yesterday from San Francisco and it is hardly in ruins. The city is as vibrant as it has ever been. It’s unemployment rate is always above the national average because of the amount of people drawn there and the number of bums.

As for Fallin, she better work hard. Oklahoma elects democratic govenors probably close to 75% of the time. You can’t gerrymander the whole state.

By: slackmeyer

slackmeyer — Mon, 27 Sep 2010 22:49:49 +0000

Mary Fallin has already been elected governor? This will be a shock to Jari, who has a nasty habit of going against the declarations of pollsters.
Interesting CAPTCHA on this one: “reasons scarme”