Comments on: MAPS 3: The Poll http://blog.newsok.com/okccentral/2009/05/12/maps-3-the-poll/ The Oklahoman's Steve Lackmeyer covers downtown OKC brick by brick. Thu, 16 Feb 2012 00:48:00 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3 By: Rick Parker http://blog.newsok.com/okccentral/2009/05/12/maps-3-the-poll/comment-page-1/#comment-2840 Rick Parker Sat, 23 May 2009 01:07:17 +0000 http://blog.newsok.com/okccentral/?p=1513#comment-2840 There is at least 40 yrs worth of building to be done on the Oklahoma River. "Core to Shore" will take out the dilapidated buildings. This will make the river projects go. The citizens of OKC want light rail. They want to be able to go from Norman to Guthrie. And Midwest City to El Reno. One day it will be OKC to Tulsa. The waiting is over. Put out your pennies again, everyone shut up! And lets start building!! There is at least 40 yrs worth of building to be done
on the Oklahoma River. “Core to Shore” will take out the
dilapidated buildings. This will make the river projects go.
The citizens of OKC want light rail. They want to be able to
go from Norman to Guthrie. And Midwest City to El Reno.
One day it will be OKC to Tulsa. The waiting is over. Put
out your pennies again, everyone shut up! And lets start
building!!

]]> By: memo.ryecroft – Life Without Cars http://blog.newsok.com/okccentral/2009/05/12/maps-3-the-poll/comment-page-1/#comment-2845 memo.ryecroft – Life Without Cars Wed, 20 May 2009 11:02:18 +0000 http://blog.newsok.com/okccentral/?p=1513#comment-2845 [...] measures in a suburban city, imagine what a precedent it would set. Most of the recent urban issue related commentary that I’ve been reading about NYC and OKC is in regards to transit and transportation. It [...] [...] measures in a suburban city, imagine what a precedent it would set. Most of the recent urban issue related commentary that I’ve been reading about NYC and OKC is in regards to transit and transportation. It [...]

]]> By: david ball http://blog.newsok.com/okccentral/2009/05/12/maps-3-the-poll/comment-page-1/#comment-2844 david ball Mon, 18 May 2009 20:46:41 +0000 http://blog.newsok.com/okccentral/?p=1513#comment-2844 i forgot to mention, make the rubber-tired trolleys run on CNG and you'll get the political backing for it. i forgot to mention, make the rubber-tired trolleys run on CNG and you’ll get the political backing for it.

]]> By: david ball http://blog.newsok.com/okccentral/2009/05/12/maps-3-the-poll/comment-page-1/#comment-2843 david ball Mon, 18 May 2009 20:44:30 +0000 http://blog.newsok.com/okccentral/?p=1513#comment-2843 we need good trolleys around downtown, streetcars radiating from downtown to areas like the farmer's market/stockyards/ airport, up classen then northwest highway, to the hospitals and state capitol, 23rd street, capitol hill, etc, and finally commuter rail connecting to other cities in the region, to be cost-shared with them. ou to uco would be very cool, but guthrie to purcell would be even better. while we're at it, we need to connect okc with tulsa. all are necessary and justifiable. from a practical political reality standpoint, okc should try to start with a perfected trolly system AND a streetcar to the airport. that will create demand for an expansion to the system, because now people could fly into will rogers, ride the streetcar downtown to their hotel, go to their convention and party in bricktown and tour downtown. it shouldn't be hard to get the northside to push for expansion to the shopping districts once it is successful. by the way, commuter rail is THE ticket for the regional transit! we need good trolleys around downtown, streetcars radiating from downtown to areas like the farmer’s market/stockyards/ airport, up classen then northwest highway, to the hospitals and state capitol, 23rd street, capitol hill, etc, and finally commuter rail connecting to other cities in the region, to be cost-shared with them. ou to uco would be very cool, but guthrie to purcell would be even better. while we’re at it, we need to connect okc with tulsa. all are necessary and justifiable. from a practical political reality standpoint, okc should try to start with a perfected trolly system AND a streetcar to the airport. that will create demand for an expansion to the system, because now people could fly into will rogers, ride the streetcar downtown to their hotel, go to their convention and party in bricktown and tour downtown. it shouldn’t be hard to get the northside to push for expansion to the shopping districts once it is successful. by the way, commuter rail is THE ticket for the regional transit!

]]> By: Brandon http://blog.newsok.com/okccentral/2009/05/12/maps-3-the-poll/comment-page-1/#comment-2842 Brandon Mon, 18 May 2009 19:51:01 +0000 http://blog.newsok.com/okccentral/?p=1513#comment-2842 I'm wondering why everyone is thinking that this is an either/or discussion? An effective transportation system is a comprehensive regional issue that addresses the next 50 years, not just the next convention or NBA season. We are having this discussion now because previously it was an either/or discussion and the car won. Light rail is going to work most effectively when it's bringing in commuters from the bedroom neighborhoods outside of the core and visitors from the airport to the hotels and convention centers. Trams, electric street cars or electric-hybrid buses are more effective in downtown where stops are more frequent. All that has been said, but that's not the issue. I think that Nick Roberts made the most important comment that may or may not have been noticed: "We can remain a city with clean air AND free of EPA fines (in terms of the millions) if we start investing in green, urban initiatives before we really have to have them." Do a calculation of the downtown population during the day, and during the night. Until the city can effectively reduce the environmental impact that the population shift illustrates, than bus or electric trolley doesn't matter. I doubt that Oklahoma City is going to experience a serious population shift or realignment of density within the next few generations...so to solve the bigger issues, you need more efficient roads, light rail transportation connections that negate the need to drive, and even hybrid buses. Everyone is on point about the benefits, perceptions, etc of the different mass transit options. But until the community takes a comprehensive look at what is needed, and demands it of their elected officials, than we will get the same transportation package we got with the original MAPS. I’m wondering why everyone is thinking that this is an either/or discussion? An effective transportation system is a comprehensive regional issue that addresses the next 50 years, not just the next convention or NBA season. We are having this discussion now because previously it was an either/or discussion and the car won.

Light rail is going to work most effectively when it’s bringing in commuters from the bedroom neighborhoods outside of the core and visitors from the airport to the hotels and convention centers. Trams, electric street cars or electric-hybrid buses are more effective in downtown where stops are more frequent. All that has been said, but that’s not the issue.

I think that Nick Roberts made the most important comment that may or may not have been noticed: “We can remain a city with clean air AND free of EPA fines (in terms of the millions) if we start investing in green, urban initiatives before we really have to have them.” Do a calculation of the downtown population during the day, and during the night. Until the city can effectively reduce the environmental impact that the population shift illustrates, than bus or electric trolley doesn’t matter. I doubt that Oklahoma City is going to experience a serious population shift or realignment of density within the next few generations…so to solve the bigger issues, you need more efficient roads, light rail transportation connections that negate the need to drive, and even hybrid buses.

Everyone is on point about the benefits, perceptions, etc of the different mass transit options. But until the community takes a comprehensive look at what is needed, and demands it of their elected officials, than we will get the same transportation package we got with the original MAPS.

]]> By: Dennis http://blog.newsok.com/okccentral/2009/05/12/maps-3-the-poll/comment-page-1/#comment-2841 Dennis Mon, 18 May 2009 18:42:52 +0000 http://blog.newsok.com/okccentral/?p=1513#comment-2841 Nick... touche! Nick… touche!

]]> By: Nick Roberts http://blog.newsok.com/okccentral/2009/05/12/maps-3-the-poll/comment-page-1/#comment-2846 Nick Roberts Sun, 17 May 2009 18:40:55 +0000 http://blog.newsok.com/okccentral/?p=1513#comment-2846 Dennis, when does a rational society choose right solutions? Dennis, when does a rational society choose right solutions?

]]> By: slackmeyer http://blog.newsok.com/okccentral/2009/05/12/maps-3-the-poll/comment-page-1/#comment-2847 slackmeyer Sun, 17 May 2009 03:54:19 +0000 http://blog.newsok.com/okccentral/?p=1513#comment-2847 "Steve, help! Hurry up and pull the plug on this thing!" Why in the world would I do that? I'm following every bit of this. I doubt you guys are going to have a meeting of minds on this one. But I remain very proud of the level of discussion going on here. “Steve, help! Hurry up and pull the plug on this thing!”
Why in the world would I do that? I’m following every bit of this. I doubt you guys are going to have a meeting of minds on this one. But I remain very proud of the level of discussion going on here.

]]> By: Dennis http://blog.newsok.com/okccentral/2009/05/12/maps-3-the-poll/comment-page-1/#comment-2848 Dennis Sat, 16 May 2009 09:35:49 +0000 http://blog.newsok.com/okccentral/?p=1513#comment-2848 It's safe to say we'll be seeing arguments between professionals that know a heck of a lot more about the subject than we do. And YES, McDonald's is better than Appplebee's when you're in a hurry, short of money, and have a car full of kids. There are some applications better suited for busses, some better suited for rail. Why would a rational society choose wrong solutions? (There I go again: criticizing Gore...) Steve, help! Hurry up and pull the plug on this thing! It’s safe to say we’ll be seeing arguments between professionals that know a heck of a lot more about the subject than we do.

And YES, McDonald’s is better than Appplebee’s when you’re in a hurry, short of money, and have a car full of kids. There are some applications better suited for busses, some better suited for rail. Why would a rational society choose wrong solutions? (There I go again: criticizing Gore…)

Steve, help! Hurry up and pull the plug on this thing!

]]> By: Nick Roberts http://blog.newsok.com/okccentral/2009/05/12/maps-3-the-poll/comment-page-1/#comment-2849 Nick Roberts Sat, 16 May 2009 01:06:49 +0000 http://blog.newsok.com/okccentral/?p=1513#comment-2849 It is not up for dispute that streetcar is better than buses. It is an inconvenient truth. Just kidding..but seriously, do you want to try and prove that buses are actually better? It's like..could someone really argue that McD's is better than Applebee's? It is not up for dispute that streetcar is better than buses. It is an inconvenient truth.

Just kidding..but seriously, do you want to try and prove that buses are actually better? It’s like..could someone really argue that McD’s is better than Applebee’s?

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