Public Safety Center Forum Set For Monday…Part 2
This letter is in response to Randel Shadid’s letter regarding the proposed Edmond Public Safety Center.
My name is Chris Cook, I am the President of the Edmond Fraternal Order of Police (FOP) and a Detective with the Edmond Police Department. We are urging residents to vote yes to the proposed new Safety Center that will house the Police Department, Emergency Management and the 911 Call Center.
I would like to clear up erroneous information that was included in Mr. Shadid’s recent letter.
#1.The building will cost $379 per square foot, not the more than $400 stated by Mr. Shadid. This is not the same as building a house, laboratories, a 911 Center and the Jail facility require extra security measures which increases the cost per square foot.
#2. Mr. Shadid failed to mention that the Benham Group that recommended a 55,000 square foot facility was not a Police design team and did not have the knowledge of how Police Departments evolve as they grow and require space needs for that growth. The Benham group was looking at today’s needs, we need a space that will take us many years into the future.
The second design group came up with a larger facility because they added in the 911 Call Center, Emergency Management and the Emergency Operations Center.
Mr. Shadid then compared the proposed Public Safety Center to the OSBI building. That is a building that is a lab and will only house 60 people. The proposed Public Safety Center will eventually house more than 350 personnel and is smaller in square footage than the OSBI facility.
Should we just repeat our old mistakes, shouldn’t be learn from history? In 1995 the city built for the needs of 1995, that was shallow thinking then, and it would be again today, if we take that same path.
By building this proposed Public Safety Center, we are trying to plan for the future by building a structure that will fit Edmond’s needs 20 to 50 years down the road.
#3. Mr. Shadid’s suggestion of leaving the Police Department building downtown, would drive the cost of the project up several million dollars, which is irresponsible spending of taxpayer’s money.
#4. The funding source is also an issue for Mr. Shadid. Proposed funding sources were studied by the cities Finance Committee which consists of financial leaders and advisors in the community, it was not handled by city staff.
When considering sales tax versus property tax it was obvious that funding the project with property taxes WILL SAVE TAXPAYERS SEVERAL MILLION DOLLARS!
In fact, the City of Edmond Treasurer, Stephen Schaus, says that the General Obligation bond will SAVE taxpayers approximately $14 million dollars. On the other hand, a sales tax would require the city borrow several million dollars more than needed as a reserve fund, and the interest rates would have been much higher. Even with the proposed property tax increase, Edmond would still have the lowest millage rate of all major surrounding communities.
#5. Mr. Shadid mentioned the Edmond Public Schools in his letter, as a matter of record, Edmond Public School officials have been included in the talks regarding the proposed Public Safety Center and understand the need for the facility and do not oppose the proposed funding mechanism.
#6. Lastly, Mr. Shadid says there is a lack of support from former Edmond Mayors for the proposed Public Safety Center, this is definitely not true as former Mayor Carl Reherman sat on the community needs assessment committee and is the campaign manger for the “Vote Yes, Keep Edmond Safe” campaign. Sounds like not only support, but resounding support.
There are a very few, yet loud opponents of the proposed Public Safety Center, and they are all opposed to the project because of their own vested interests. We are asking everyone to get informed and know the truth. A good place to start is at this website, edmondok.com, select Public Safety Center and watch the video.
The bottom line, Edmond needs a new Police Station and 911 Call Center to continue to provide the outstanding professional service our residents have come to expect.
This is more than a slogan, it is a fact, Keep Edmond Safe, Vote Yes on Proposition 1 November 4th.
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Comments
Bill Says:
October 16th, 2008 at 7:10 am
Chris,
“I think now they are talking about working 10 hour shifts or something like that, and the thread looks like it has turned into a place for cops to air their greivances against the City.”
I think that it becasue the city as well as the FOP has asked the officers to go out an encourage eveyone they can to approve this vote. Obviously the officers feel they have more important issues to compete with than a new fancy PS center.
I will agree that the property tax is not the way to go with this thing.
Bill also says that the area proposed to being built has zero growth. Does it not matter that there is a community already there? Im continuing to see new building as houses go up in that exact square mile so how does that equal zero growth.
They need a new station, no doubt. Im not opposed to a new station or even the location proposed. But I have to agree with Rice (although I really hate to agree with him and his obvious personal agandas), this is not the right way or the right time.
Sorry RJH, that probably was a bit harsh when I said a zero growth area. I meant to imply that the City is growing to the East. Almost 3/4 of the City’s land is East of I-35. Projections indicate that Covell and I-35 will be the hub of this city in 20 years.
As far as #3 goes, and I’m not an officer, unfortunately no matter where the site is planned to go people argue against it. People though it should go out to the City Campus but others said it should stay central. No matter what is said people are going to argue.
It really sucks that people add their own agendas (not you) to the mix. I can’t understand why in this world people waste so much time working to go against each other than working together to accomplish anything.
I think the station is needed, and putting it central to the city right now is a good choice. The majority of the population is here on the west side of I35 and will be for quite some time. If a substation is needed later than so be it. I bet if you looked at call volumes geographically you would see the huge difference. My understanding is that officers patrol distircts but the main job of paperwork is done at the station and they must go there numerous times per shift. Makes sense to keep them central to the city where they can respond easily.
And why pollute this issue with you mentioning 10 hour shifts? That sounds like a staffing issue not related to this. I think 10 hour shifts are common anyway. Not for me to decide what they do with that, no more than walking in McDonalds and thinking I have a say since I’m buying a cheeseburger from them.
Some of these points, I’m wondering about, considering it seems like Mr. Cook didn’t read Mr. Shadid’s letter very carefully. However, there are some good points in both letters. I ABSOLUTELY want our police department to have their facility. Likewise, I REALLY cannot afford more taxes right now. But my real observation is this: in the past, Edmond has shown itself to be really bad at looking to the future. It may be difficult to see, depending on your perspective. But one example is our traffic and street situation. If you’ve been driving in it for years, you probably don’t give it much thought beyond the fact that you wish you didn’t have to drive in traffic like that. But if the planning had been better 20 or 30 years ago, it wouldn’t be like that now. If you ever get the chance to visit Lubbock, Texas sometime, drive around the city streets and you’ll see what I mean (yeah, I know – it’s Lubbock). ALL of the streets there have left turn lanes and the drivers there mostly know how to use them. A lot of the intersections also have dedicated right-turning lanes carved out as well so that no one has to sit and wait for the light to change.
My point is, you can’t build the public building you need now. The building is going to be in use for 50-60-75, maybe even 100 years. It needs to last. You have to build the building for your needs 20 years from now at the very least. You start remodeling when you’re squeezed 30 years from now.
As for how to fund? I don’t know why property tax vs. sales tax. I wish I could have been at the forum Monday night so I could have a better understanding, but I am behind on reading my RSS feeds and didn’t know about until too late. (Seems like there was no news about the forum from anyone until the forum was over though. Hmm. How does one find out about these things in advance when you’re on information overload?) I am, as yet, undecided on this issue. I support our law enforcement officers. But I am at this point still trying to figure out how I am going to pay this year’s property taxes, much less next year’s.
I am an Edmond Police Officer, so please understand why I am posting anonymously. Could you imagine if I had a “NO” sign in my yard? I am also a property owner here in Edmond, and I believe that there are better options than the one being proposed. We do need another station but not in the form of the current proposal. It is too much money and the proposed location is in no way strategic to the growth of the city. If it were up to me, we would fund it through sales tax and put the new facility at Covell and I-35, where the city already owns a massive tract of land.
The property taxes are already too high in Edmond and are going to go higher. The Edmond Schools will ask for more property taxes in December, $36.2 million. There is also an outstanding lawsuit in which the City will have to pay multi-upon-multi millions of dollars to the Officers. It is just a matter of time before this is tacked onto the property tax rolls.
Once again, I am an Edmond Police Officer and I will vote NO on Nov 4th. As an Officer, I know that we desperately need a new facility. As a taxpayer, I am telling the City to come up with a better, more cost effective proposal, at a location that will truly serve the city in the way it is intended.
Chris,
Are you going to respond? I would like to hear your insight on the four previously mentioned issues:
1. Cost
2. Funding
3. Location
4. Other pending property tax issues (school and lawsuit)
Still waiting….
Let me answer the question on whether or not we need a station of this size with the price tag of $31.5 million dollars. First of all, we have had one of the best public safety building architect firms in the country look at this. They have looked at everything that is currently needed and they have taken into consideration how fast our city is growing. My Father always told me that if anything was worth doing, then you should do it right the first time. I think that wisdom should be applied to the new Public Safety Building as well. We need to do this project right this time for the future public safety needs of our city.
To answer the question on why we are doing a property tax as compared with a sales tax, I would like to remind everyone that our citizens will save more than 10 million dollars if we pass this proposition. Property taxes are also tax deductible so it lessens the cost to the average tax payer.
Some people have been talking about another tax increase from the Edmond Public Schools. Let me clear this up, the Edmond Public Schools tax vote in December is to continue the tax that is already there. That means that they are not asking for an increase in taxes, just to renew the one that is coming due. As a matter of record, Edmond Public School officials have been included in the talks regarding the proposed Public Safety Center and understand the need for the facility and do not oppose the proposed funding mechanism.
Another issue that was brought up is a lawsuit against the city for non-payment of wages. This lawsuit is still pending and will likely be tied up for several years to come. I am unsure of the mechanism that will be used to pay for a possible award.
Finally, the location of the proposed Public Safety Center is in question. This specific location was selected because it will not cost the city any additional money to build there. Any location in the downtown area would drive up the costs of this project by the millions of dollars and we believe that this would not be a good use of taxpayer’s money. The idea was to keep the Public Safety Center near the downtown area and as cost effective as possible.
Hopefully this answers any question from my earlier letter. Thank you.
Why should only the property owners of Edmond have to pay for these public safety services when EVERYONE in Edmond benefits from them!!!! A sales tax or some other way that does not single out certain people to fund this project would be the best way. I am for a new facility but not funded in this way or at this location!
Chris,
I too believe that Edmond needs a new Public Safety Center, but disagree with you on the cost, method of funding, and it’s proposed location. I don’t have a vested interest or ulterior motive in this project, other than this is my money that the City is asking for. And the Edmond Schools are going to be asking for more money again in December with another $36mil bond issue that will affect my property taxes.Then there is the possibility that we will have another increase in the near future when the City of Edmond has to pay a rather large judgement to the Officers for failing to pay them for time on the clock.
Being that you are a Police Officer, please address these concerns to the best of your ability. I tried to engage these issues on one of the other blog threads and didn’t really get anywhere. I think now they are talking about working 10 hour shifts or something like that, and the thread looks like it has turned into a place for cops to air their greivances against the City.
1. Cost – It seems to me that the City is trying to hit a homerun and deliver a product that is well beyond the means that we need or can support. I understand that we pay the price for having great services here in Edmond, but this is too much. Even if this project gets approved, they won’t start it for another 3-5 years. So based upon an inflation rate of 3-6% per year, and then the cost over-runs that will happen once the project starts, this could end up being a $40mil + golden egg. Plus with the economy the way it is, how can the City honestly ask a person who is looking at job loss to fork over more money out of their own pockets? Massive job losses are just around the corner and are coming in a big way according to all of the experts.
2. Method of Funding – There are several vehicles to fund this project. Sales tax is one. Property tax is the other, which is usually reserved for the school system. What keeps the City from asking for more property tax funding in the future? I think that citizens are getting tired of getting stuck with the bill for things that should have been planned for. In this next bond issue, I think the schools are asking for $900,000 for roofing expenses as a part of the $36mil proposal…. WTH! That should have been planned and budgeted for! So should have the City planned with this project. I plan for future expenses and budget, most responsible people plan and live on a budget, and so should our public entities.
3. Location – This is probably the most misunderstood issue for me. Why does the City say they want to make this a 50 year facility, and then propose it to be built in an area that has nearly zero growth, and is farther away from the direction that the city is growing? Why aren’t they proposing it be built at Covell and I-35, where the current City Complex is, where the City already owns the land, where in 20 years will be the hub of the city? It doesn’t make sense and leads me to believe that the City has ulterior motive to push it at it’s proposed location. Covell and I-35 seems to be the most logocal place to build it.
4. Pending property tax increases – The schools are going to ask for another $36.2 million in December, which will be tied to our property taxes, just like this proposal will be. The Edmond Police Officers have a pending lawsuit against the City that appears to highly favor the Officers. This will also be put onto our property taxes as it is the only way for the City to pay it. How much is this going to cost us, and when does it end?
I look forward to your response.